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Post by baydoll on Nov 15, 2013 9:32:18 GMT -5
Revelation 18:7 states:
"How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously , so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow."
does anyone know what that means?
I've always wondered about this particular verse.
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Post by PrisonerOfHope on Nov 15, 2013 15:29:04 GMT -5
From my studies, I think it just means that she's filled with pride and will never have to suffer any kind of lack or sorrow.
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Post by baydoll on Nov 16, 2013 7:16:58 GMT -5
What about the 'I am no widow' part? I get the haughty prideful tone but is there a particular singular meaning behind 'I am no widow' or was that a figurative way of saying I will never see sorrow? It's an extremely odd phrase and it isn't seen anywhere else in the Bible, as far as I know. Should it be taken literally? Like this 'woman' has an actual husband whom according to her, will never die? <------- confused, as usual.
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Post by PrisonerOfHope on Nov 20, 2013 16:57:57 GMT -5
I've been contemplating this, and here's what popped into my mind. (Not saying it's definitely Holy Spirit inspired or anything; take it for what you will...)
OK, there are TWO women in Revelation - the Bride of Christ, and the Whore of Babylon. Perhaps the Whore is bragging that she's not dependent on any one man and would be devastated if he were to die, making her a widow - she thinks she'll always have men (the false religions of the world) giving her what she wants so she can continue on in her luxurious lifestyle.
What do you think?
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Post by popcorn on Nov 20, 2013 18:59:45 GMT -5
Isaiah 47:6-8 The Fall of Babylon Predicted …6"I was angry with My people, I profaned My heritage And gave them into your hand. You did not show mercy to them, On the aged you made your yoke very heavy. 7"Yet you said, 'I will be a queen forever.' These things you did not consider Nor remember the outcome of them. 8"Now, then, hear this, you sensual one, Who dwells securely, Who says in your heart, 'I am, and there is no one besides me. I will not sit as a widow, Nor know loss of children.'… Cross References to Revelation 18:7 biblehub.com/isaiah/47-7.htmYes I would agree.
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Post by baydoll on Nov 22, 2013 6:56:51 GMT -5
That's what I was looking for!!! Thanks, guys!! That's the understanding I got from it too but thought it was 'off the wall' or headed in the wrong direction so I was waiting to for someone to either confirm it (or not). And thanks for that verse, Popcorn, I completely missed it. It further proves Arlene's point nicely, doesn't it.
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Post by popcorn on Nov 22, 2013 7:11:56 GMT -5
A lot of people try to put America in Revalation 18 . But I think it is the catholic church religious political queen.
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Post by baydoll on Nov 22, 2013 7:28:37 GMT -5
No I don't think it's America's political system either. Although I do believe the US will certainly play a huge part in helping the One World Order to take shape, so to speak. It's happening now. The US is quickly losing it's relevancy in the world, that's for sure. I think that's why we don't see her in prophecy anywhere regarding the last days. Our present evil leader and his equally evil administration is making sure of that. Oh well, it is what it is, I guess. God is still on His Throne and is still in control. I agree.... I think the RCC is in the runnings to be the 'head' of this religious system. Or she may be the composite of all the false religions that will come together in the last days for one final kumbaya party. God will have the final say though.
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Post by PrisonerOfHope on Nov 22, 2013 13:31:11 GMT -5
I checked my MacArthur Study Bible, and he says pretty much what I thought - it's a matter of pride and self-sufficiency.
Also, in his opinion Mystery Babylon is the world's political/economic/religious system as a whole.
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Post by OnThe3dge on Dec 5, 2013 15:31:27 GMT -5
Hi all, some thoughts on this: The previous chapter in Rev. tells us that the harlot had been riding the Beast, but it threw her off and devoured her. So in that respect the "mate" she had been relying upon was now gone, leaving her desolate as a widow with no support. Also, scripture seems to only describe two entities as brides/wives: Israel or the church. In my opinion, the reason John is shocked to see her is because he recognizes her as what was once the pure bride of Christ, who became unfaithful and sank into debauchery, murdering many among the real Bride. She is false religion, but also has been passing herself off as true religion. There is more to all this, but too much to type here. Please see my commentary on Rev. here: bible.fether.net/commentary.php?booky=Revl
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Post by PrisonerOfHope on Dec 5, 2013 23:25:37 GMT -5
So basically, you see her as the harlot (false) church?
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Post by OnThe3dge on Dec 6, 2013 6:50:54 GMT -5
So basically, you see her as the harlot (false) church? Yes. But this is not to say that a false Christianity is "the world religion", because the scriptures never teach this. All it says is that at the midpoint of the trib the Beast will demand to be the only god worshiped. There is definitely an ecumenical movement to dilute all religions, but I don't know that they'll be rolled into one.
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Post by baydoll on Dec 6, 2013 14:50:30 GMT -5
Hi all, some thoughts on this: The previous chapter in Rev. tells us that the harlot had been riding the Beast, but it threw her off and devoured her. So in that respect the "mate" she had been relying upon was now gone, leaving her desolate as a widow with no support. Also, scripture seems to only describe two entities as brides/wives: Israel or the church. In my opinion, the reason John is shocked to see her is because he recognizes her as what was once the pure bride of Christ, who became unfaithful and sank into debauchery, murdering many among the real Bride. She is false religion, but also has been passing herself off as true religion. There is more to all this, but too much to type here. Please see my commentary on Rev. here: bible.fether.net/commentary.php?booky=RevlHi OnThe3dge! Thanks for responding! I pretty much agree with you with everything you wrote but I'm still stuck on the woman saying she isn't a widow. Why would she say this? It must be important or God wouldn't had included it in His Revelation. Is she just being difficult or was she telling the truth (she really isn't/wasn't a widow)? Or...am I being nitpicky and obsessing and making too much out of this?
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Post by baydoll on Dec 6, 2013 14:54:14 GMT -5
So basically, you see her as the harlot (false) church? Why would the Harlot say she isn't a widow? And who was her husband? And what happened to him to make her say he isn't 'dead'?
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Post by OnThe3dge on Dec 6, 2013 14:58:50 GMT -5
Hi all, some thoughts on this: The previous chapter in Rev. tells us that the harlot had been riding the Beast, but it threw her off and devoured her. So in that respect the "mate" she had been relying upon was now gone, leaving her desolate as a widow with no support. Also, scripture seems to only describe two entities as brides/wives: Israel or the church. In my opinion, the reason John is shocked to see her is because he recognizes her as what was once the pure bride of Christ, who became unfaithful and sank into debauchery, murdering many among the real Bride. She is false religion, but also has been passing herself off as true religion. There is more to all this, but too much to type here. Please see my commentary on Rev. here: bible.fether.net/commentary.php?booky=RevlHi OnThe3dge! Thanks for responding! I pretty much agree with you with everything you wrote but I'm still stuck on the woman saying she isn't a widow. Why would she say this? It must be important or God wouldn't had included it in His Revelation. Is she just being difficult or was she telling the truth (she really isn't/wasn't a widow)? Or...am I being nitpicky and obsessing and making too much out of this? Personally, I think it's more a matter of the whole list of things, and that not being a widow means not being impoverished. But I really don't think it's a big deal by itself.
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Post by baydoll on Dec 7, 2013 8:20:54 GMT -5
Hi OnThe3dge! So the widow is 'mocking' God, in other words. Okay now that makes a bit more sense! I've been making WAY too much (literally) out of this ' lady's ' statement! Now with that in mind, perhaps her 'husband' is a compilation of ALL false religions that married her (the Great Harlot/Babylon, so-called Queen of Heaven, the Mother of ALL false religions that have arisen out of the history of Mankind ). Therefore her claim is true up UNTIL that day God puts an end to her mocking and 'little' wandering ways. Until then, she continues to be boastful and arrogant because she really and truly ISN'T a widow. Thus Popcorn's verse in Isaiah furthers this points nicely : 7 And you said, 'I shall be a lady forever,' So that you did not take these things to heart, Nor remember the latter end of them. 8 "Therefore hear this now, you who are given to pleasures, Who dwell securely, Who say in your heart, 'I am, and there is no one else besides me; I shall not sit as a widow, Nor shall I know the loss of children'; (Isaiah 47:7-8 New King James version) Just 'who' are these 'children' of hers? Why all those rebel followers of false religions (the'husband') of course! She 'begotten' those 'children' with her 'husbands'! And those 'children' and those many 'husbands' of hers are still 'around' today! By George I think we've got it!
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Post by OnThe3dge on Dec 7, 2013 8:32:29 GMT -5
Yep. And though we won't figure everything out, the important thing is that we're trying.
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Post by baydoll on Dec 7, 2013 8:41:42 GMT -5
Yep. And though we won't figure everything out, the important thing is that we're trying. Amen, Brother! ...for now we see through a glass darkly...
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Post by popcorn on Dec 7, 2013 8:54:04 GMT -5
Morning guys and gals! Its cold
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Post by OnThe3dge on Dec 7, 2013 9:42:50 GMT -5
Our temps are in the teens right now, and are expected to hit single digits by Monday.
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Post by baydoll on Dec 7, 2013 10:41:42 GMT -5
Morning guys and gals! Its cold Morning, Popcorn! Brrr....that little guy looks cold! Us too, OnThe3dge. The warm temps (and the stormy weather with it) have since moved off here in Southern Maryland (for now, anyway). They're calling for snow/sleet/ice/rain for us tomorrow, I'm guessing that's the storm system that was bothering you guys heading our way. Oh well, looks like back to normal, I guess...
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