Post by wateredseeds on Mar 12, 2012 2:13:18 GMT -5
Of course i love Mike, but he has a habit of deviating from the scriptures as well...and presenting his opinions over the word of God. Is he right most of the time? Yes. But he is very poor at separating biblical practice from those who are taking license and deceiving many. A great example of this is how he condemns blessed handkerchiefs...though right to condemn them from particular teachers that are false prophets and are looking to PROFIT, like those that ask for money in exchange, he doesn't present the biblical side.
"11And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul: 12So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them."-Acts 19:11-12
It's also important to note that God is not a respecter of persons...and so we can't simply isolate this kind of favor to Paul. It is either biblical or it is not. Though if it is biblical...it can obviously be perverted.
Another example is his condemning of the laying on of hands....though this is not only done throughout scripture....it is said that THOSE WHO BELIEVE WILL DO IT.
"17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."-Mark 16:17-18
Of course the bible also warns us not to lay hands on someone hastily. We shouldn't run around like these nutjobs going BAM and causing people to fall over. That is false, and he is right to expose it....but shouldn't he present the biblical side of doing it? I lay hands on people(only with permission), and people have been healed. Of course Jesus is the one that healed them, but it was them putting their faith in action. They knew that the bible said they could be healed by someone(trusted) laying hands on them.
The devil has his counterfeits of course...but can we please not throw out the baby with the bath water? If we disregarded every practice of the word of God because satan has a counterfeit....we would be powerless....and that is one of the lies of Satan as well. He doesn't want people to believe they can be healed, or that they have power from the Holy Ghost to preach the gospel or to use gifts given by God.
Post by PrisonerOfHope on Mar 12, 2012 15:41:36 GMT -5
I totally disagree. This is yet another case of taking an occurrence in the Bible and making a doctrine out of it. Yes, people used handkerchiefs that had touched Paul- but in what chapter and verse does it say that others are to emulate that practice down to this day? It doesn't! And who are these "handkerchiefs" supposed to touch? The Pope? Robert Schuller? Oral Roberts? It's the same with the so-called "Prayer of Jabez," or "setting a fleece." I'm sure that if these were supposed to be practices that were to be accepted by everyone, the Bible would be quite clear on them, as it is with communion where Jesus specifically said, "DO THIS in remembrance of me."
This kind of thing is just another device that unscrupulous "preachers" use to fleece their flocks by taking Scripture out of context. A few months after my husband died, I found out my pastor's wife had left him and set up her own "ministry." Despite the fact that we had been friends, she never once called or dropped a note to ask how I was, but one day I received an envelope from her in which was a handkerchief and instructions to send her "my largest bill" in return for this "miracle" cloth. Yeah, right.... To this day I regret that I didn't send her my largest bill and a note thanking her for paying it for me, since I was struggling so much.
As for your allegation that Mike Hoggard - of all people - would even think of deviating from the Scriptures, you couldn't be more wrong.
Last Edit: Mar 12, 2012 15:56:49 GMT -5 by PrisonerOfHope
Post by wateredseeds on Mar 12, 2012 16:52:37 GMT -5
POH,
I think you raised a valid point, and so did Mike. But leaving out the context of scripture.....is bad. Criticism of these invalid doctrines is good...but it's not enough to simply say DON'T DO IT. You have to present them in light of the scriptures. I love pastor mike, but sometimes he just says NO because he doesn't like stuff...not because it is scriptural to say no.
I did see a good teaching once on the handkerchief thing....that said that it was exclusive to Paul because God was validating Paul's ministry at a time when people were questioning him. I think that is at least a biblical way to look at it.
The laying on of hands thing? That bugged me a lot more. I've never been into the handkerchief stuff because i've NEVER seen anyone present their handkerchief whatever stuff as biblical...so i can give him a pass on that. The laying on of hands though....he doesn't EVER talk about the biblical way to lay hands on someone. I just laid hands on someone here in the store a half hour ago to pray for him. He had just got saved and needs help. Can we please give context?
It's the same with the so-called "Prayer of Jabez," or "setting a fleece." I'm sure that if these were supposed to be practices that were to be accepted by everyone, the Bible would be quite clear on them, as it is with communion where Jesus specifically said, "DO THIS in remembrance of me." 