Apostasia or Departure???

[shann0]

Discussion please!!!

www.cephas-library.com/rapture_apostasia_vs_departure.html

Apostasia vs Departure
For that day will not arrive until the 'departure' comes?




3 "Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not arrive until the departure comes and the man of lawlessness (sin) is revealed, the son of destruction. 4 He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, and as a result he takes his seat in God's temple, displaying himself as God.
5 Surely you recall that I used to tell you these things while I was still with you. 6 And so you know what holds him back, so that he will be revealed in his own time. 7 For the hidden power of lawlessness is already at work. However, the one who holds him back will do so until he is taken out of the way, 8 and then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will destroy by the breath of his mouth and wipe out by the manifestation of his arrival." 2 Thessalonians 2:3-8
Verses 3-5 above provide a description of the order of events:
1. The removal of the Church
2. The revealing of the antichrist
3. The antichrist presenting himself as God
And then again in verses 6-8:

1. The Church is holding the antichrist back, though he is still at work now
2. He is to be revealed in the right time
3. The One who holds him back (the Church) is taken out of the way
4. The lawless one (antichrist) is revealed
5. The Lord returns to destroy the antichrist (Second Coming)

When using the word "departure" or "removal" in verse 3 above, the subsequent verses coincide and restate the same events. We have three similar statements on the removal of the Church first, and then the revealing of the antichrist. Even so, we can turn to modern Greek scholars who can give us a clearer understanding as new advances in language and etymology studies often reveal:

We should be intrigued by those Greek scholars who have looked at the etymology of the word apostasia as it relates to the Greeks and the Jews. The recent English translation of the word has generally been accepted as a "falling away." Apostasia is most theologically debated when referring to 2 Thess 2:3, specifically noting events that must precede the Day of the Lord (Second Coming).
In that passage there are at least four views on the meaning of apostasia: (1) a designation for the Man of Sin (Chrysostom, Theophylact, Augustine, Alford, Moffatt); (2) the religious apostasy that will precede the Second Coming of Christ (Calvin, Chafer, Walvoord, Ryrie, Gundry); (3) the religious-political rebellion against Christ that will culminate in the Battle of Armageddon (Hogg, Vine, Moore, Morris, Bruce); and (4) the rapture of the Church, in the sense of physical departure from the earth (English, Wuest, House, Ice).

What is important to know is who were Paul's listeners and what they understood by the term apostasia. Acts 17 says that Paul and Silas came to Thessalonica where there was a synagogue of the Jews. We know Paul reasoned with them from the Scriptures, and some of them believed and joined themselves to Paul and Silas, and of the devout Greeks there were a great multitude. These Thessalonians, both the Jews and the Greeks who went to the synagogue, were well exposed to the Old Testament, which they would be familiar with, and would have regarded apostasia to mean Jewish religious defection, abandonment, or total removal from the faith (not just a "falling away").
The expression or meaning of the word was more than a "falling away;" rather it was a removal or complete departure. According to Dr. Thomas Ice, that meaning is correctly given in the first seven English translations of the Bible where apostasia is translated as either "departure" or "departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608).

Dr. Ice notes apostasia appears just twice in the New Testament. In addition to 2 Thess. 2:3, it occurs in Acts 21:21, where, speaking of Paul, it is said "that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake (aspostasia) Moses." The core meaning of the word in that verse is "defection" or "departure." The Lidell and Scott Greek Lexicon defines apostasia first as a defection or revolt, then secondly as departure or disappearance. When considering the context of the surrounding passages of 2 Thess. 2:3-8, we can see the word apostasia truly means departure or disappearance. More evidence is given by Jerome's Latin Vulgate from around the time of 400 A.D. which renders apostasia as "discessio," meaning departure. Why was the King James Version the first to change the established translation of "departure?" There is no reason, other than reformation scholars of the time were attempting to transliterate (applying a certain meaning), which unfortunately continued in all following English translations.
Dr. Allan A. MacRae, Ph.D., a noted Greek scholar and translator, and president of theology schools, speaks of the striking parallel between verse 3 of 2 Thess 2, and verses 7-8. Verse 3 mentions the departure of the Church as coming first, and then tells of the revealing of the man of lawlessness. In verses 7 and 8 we find the identical sequence. Verse 7 tells of the removal of the Church; verse 8 says: "And then shall that lawless one be revealed." Thus close examination of the passage shows an inner unity and coherence, if we take the word apostasia in its general sense of "departure," while a superficial examination would easily lead to an erroneous interpretation as "falling away" because of the proximity of the mention of the "man of sin."
Dr. Kenneth S. Wuest, LL. D., (Doctor of Laws), a noted Greek scholar, New Testament translator, Greek word-study author and professor, adds further contextual support for taking apostasia as a physical departure. He notes apostasia of which Paul is speaking (verse 3), precedes the revelation of antichrist in his true identity, and that which holds him back (verse 6) also precedes his revelation. The apostasia, therefore, cannot be either a general apostasy in Christendom, nor can it be the particular apostasy which is the result of his activities in making himself the alone object of worship. Furthermore, that which holds back his revelation (verse 3) is vitally connected with verse 7, He who holds back the same event. Dr. Wuest is driven to the inescapable conclusion that the apostasia in verse 3 refers to the removal of the Church which precedes the Day of the Lord (Second Coming), and holds back the revelation of the Man of Sin who ushers in the world-aspect of that period.

The English word departure certainly fits the conext (or coherency) of 2 Thessalonians 2:3-8. Most post-tribulation theologians refuse to address the entire context as it is given, and thus insist the lexical evidence does not suggest a physical departure. But that is exactly what the lexical evidence does suggest. Dismissing the obvious coherence in those passages would be simple ignorance or a stubborn refusal to consider the Scriptural evidence. Remember, if we take a word out of context and apply a dissimilar meaning, we have then created a new pre-text. Likely that happened in the translation in the King James and later versions.

5. Teaching of the rapture, specifically the pre-tribulation rapture, was never taught before the Reformation.

A common argument is that none of the early Church fathers acknowledged or taught the pre-tribulation rapture, and thus the idea of a "rapture" is a relatively new concept. That argument is not only false, but lacks an understanding of Church history. For example, not until after the Protestant Reformation did people get copies of the Bible and once again adopt a literal interpretation, and thus begin to understand prophecy as it was intended. This is when the concept of the pre-tribulation rapture was revived, not invented.

Remember, since Augustine, a literal interpretation of Bible prophecy was prohibited. Prior to that, we have numerous examples of early Church fathers writing about the rapture. Specifically, these writings were pertaining to imminency (meaning the return of Jesus Christ for the Church can happen at any moment). Imminency is especially prominent in the writings of the apostolic fathers (up to the third century A.D.). They had no reason to conclude otherwise, as they relied on the strength of the literal fulfillment of prophecy in the Old Testament.

In the first century A.D., Clement and Ignatius wrote frequently of the imminent return of Jesus Christ for the Church. Other early Christian texts, such as the Didache (Greek: teaching), also known as the "Teaching of the Twelve Apostles," written about 50 A.D.—100 A.D., provided clear teaching on imminency. Another early text, the Shepherd of Hermas (or Pastor of Hermas, 110 A.D.) contained a pre-tribulation rapture concept regarding the tribulation period: "If you then prepare yourselves, and repent with all your heart, and turn to the Lord, it will be possible for you to escape it [tribulation period]." The Epistle of Barnabas (131 A.D.) is yet another early text describing imminency. This continued throughout early Church history:

Ephraim the Syrain (306 A.D.—373 A.D.) of the Byzantine Church wrote about the Lord's return as being imminent. He stated, "All saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins."
Many early Church fathers understood the concept of the Lord returning for His own before the tribulation period. They exhorted Christians to live a life of purity and faithfulness. However, with the adoption of Augustine's allegorical views by the Catholic Church in 431 A.D., the concept of a pre-tribulation ratpure was shunned. A revival of the concepts of imminency and the rapture didn't happen until after the Protestant Reformation, when people again got copies of the Bible and began interpreting it literally.
The earliest post-Reformation writings began in the 1600s. The concept of the pre-tribulation rapture was first revived by Increase Mather (1639—1723), a Puritan leader. He endeavored to prove "the Saints would be caught up into the air beforehand, thereby escaping the final conflagration [tribulation period]." Another Church leader, Peter Jurieu, taught that Christ would come in the air to rapture the Saints and return to heaven before the battle of Armageddon (from his book, Approaching Deliverance of the Church, published in 1687). Another publication on the subject came from Spain in 1812, entitled The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty, written by Emmanuel Lacunza in 1790. Lacunza was a Jesuit priest from Chile (Chilean theologian of Spanish descent) writing under the assumed name of Rabbi Juan Josafat Ben-Ezra as a converted Jew. The book was later translated into English by Presbyterian minister Edward Irving and published in England in 1827.

John Nelson Darby (1800—1882), scholar and founder of the Plymouth Brethren, was influenced by Lacunza's book. After the Reformation, Darby was the first scholar to refine the pre-tribulation rapture doctrine, and many have incorrectly thought Darby conceived the pre-tribulation rapture (or "secret" rapture) in the early 1800s. Rather, he would be one of many scholars to come who would recognize prophetic Scriptures as accurate descriptions of past, present and future promises. Even so, little understanding of prophecy, the rapture, Church Age or Israel existed within Christianity—it had to be learned again. Few theologians wrote about it, and those who did were often influenced by humanistic Alexandrian theology. The literal interpretation of prophetic passages soon gained acceptance around the world. Author William Blackstone wrote Jesus is Coming (1878), taking rapture doctrine to the prophetic forefront, as did the Scofield Study Bible in 1909. Since then hundreds of scholars, theologians, pastors and teachers have written on the topic.

The freedom to interpret the Bible literally allowed for a comprehensive system of pre-tribulational/pre-millennial theology to be developed. This could not have happened until modern times. Of course it is also true that no comprehensive systems of eschatology (study of last things) were developed until modern times. Why might this be so? The doctrine of the Trinity was known, yet not embraced by Christians until well after the first century A.D. Why would eschatology have waited until modern times for Christians to seriously work on it systematically and comprehensively? Simply put, there was no freedom to do so. Freedoms and discernments within Christendom were kept in check prior to our modern era.
The rapture doctrine was revived after the Reformation by those who could freely accept prophecy as literal. Even today, many denominations (Catholic and Protestant) continue to adhere to the false doctrines of Augustine, and thus refuse to acknowledge Bible prophecy (27% of the Bible). Unfortunately, it has been estimated that nearly 100 million American church members (about 63% of church attendees) have very little or no understanding of Bible prophecy, or the significance of Israel and events surrounding the Middle East. This is the result of Alexandrian theology. Prophetic truth has been suppressed for generations; even so, we are promised victory.

www.soundchristian.com/prophecy/

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[shann0]

www.bibleprophesy.org/clement.htm

Clement and Polycarp on the Pretribulation Rapture.

Here are some of the writings of the early Church fathers that sounds very much like they knew and believed and taught the doctrine of the pretribulation rapture, even if they didn't articulate it explicitly in our modern terms that we use in discussion.

First, see Pseudo-Ephraem's Pre Tribulation Rapture Statement (c. 374-627) "All the saints and elect of God are gathered together before the tribulation, which is to come, and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins."

Link to writings of Early Church Fathers: www.ccel.org/fathers2/

In The First Epistle of Clement to the Corinthians, dated 68AD or 97AD, from
www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-05.htm#P171_20841

Is the writer exhorting about and appealing to the truth of the pretribulation rapture in these examples? I have picked out a few important exerpts below:


Chapter IX
Let us stedfastly contemplate those who have perfectly ministered to His excellent glory. Let us take (for instance) Enoch, who, being found righteous in obedience, was translated, and death was never known to happen to him. Noah, being found faithful, preached regeneration to the world through his ministry; and the Lord saved by him the animals which, with one accord, entered into the ark.

[Enoch is an example of the rapture. Gen 5:24 "And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him." Hebrews 11:5 "By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God."]

[Noah, and Lot discussed below, are examples of deliverance from wrath, which are examples of the pretrib rapture. Compare with 2 Peter 2:5-9]

2Pe 2:5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
2Pe 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
2Pe 2:7 And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
2Pe 2:8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;)
2Pe 2:9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:]

Chapter XI.
On account of his hospitality and godliness, Lot was saved out of Sodore when all the country round was punished by means of fire and brimstone, the Lord thus making it manifest that He does not forsake those that hope in Him, but gives up such as depart from Him to punishment and torture. For Lot's wife, who went forth with him, being of a different mind from himself and not continuing in agreement with him [as to the command which had been given them], was made an example of, so as to be a pillar of salt unto this day. This was done that all might know that those who are of a double mind, and who distrust the power of God, bring down judgment on themselves and become a sign to all succeeding generations.

While "those who are of a double mind, and who distrust the power of God" and "bring down judgment on themselves" are an example of those who will miss the rapture to enter the tribulation.

Chapter XIX
His mighty and surpassingly great gifts and benefactions, of peace. Let us contemplate Him with our understanding, and look with the eyes of our soul to His long-suffering will. Let us reflect how free from wrath He is towards all His creation.

[This wording, "free from wrath", is example of our pretrib promises as follows:]

1 Thess 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which
delivered us from the wrath to come.

1 Thess 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Chapter XXII
The face of the Lord is against them that do evil, to cut off the remembrance of them from the earth. The righteous cried, and the Lord heard him, and delivered him out of all his troubles."95 "Many are the stripes [appointed for] the wicked; but mercy shall compass those about who hope in the Lord."

[This wording, "delivered him out of all his troubles" is like being delivered by the rapture from the time of trouble to come.]

Chapter XXIII
"Wretched are they who are of a double mind, and of a doubting heart; who say, These things we have heard even in the times of our fathers; but, behold, we have grown old, and none of them has happened unto us.

Of a truth, soon and suddenly shall His will be accomplished, as the Scripture also bears witness, saying, "Speedily will He come, and will not tarry; "99 and, "The Lord shall suddenly come to His temple, even the Holy One, for whom ye look."100

[The doctrine of the sedition, of the double minded, was the occasion for which Clement's letter was written. The sedition was the doubting of the resurrection and the coming of the Lord, becuase it still had not yet come, "none of [these things] has happened unto us". People in the Church had begun to doubt the coming of the Lord and the resurrection in the days when the New Testament was still being written, and Peter addressed it also:]

2Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
2Peter 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.:

[After speaking of the resurrection for two chapters, Clement continues with a statement that is clearly pretrib, "so that, through His mercy, we may be protected from the judgments to come", which is very much like Rev 3:10 "Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.":]

XXVIII
Since then all things are seen and heard [by God], let us fear Him, and forsake those wicked works which proceed from evil desires; so that, through His mercy, we may be protected from the judgments to come. For whither can any of us flee from His mighty hand? Or what world will receive any of those who run away from Him? For the Scripture saith in a certain place, "Whither shall I go, and where shall I be hid from Thy presence? If I ascend into heaven, Thou art there; if I go away even to the uttermost parts of the earth, there is Thy right hand; if I make my bed in the abyss, there is Thy Spirit." Whither, then, shall any one go, or where shall he escape from Him who comprehends all things?

Chapter XXXIX
But call now, if any one will answer thee, or if thou wilt look to any of the holy angels; for wrath destroys the foolish man, and envy killeth him that is in error. I have seen the foolish taking root, but their habitation was presently consumed. Let their sons be far from safety; let them be despised172 before the gates of those less than themselves, and there shall be none to deliver. For what was prepared for them, the righteous shall eat; and they shall not be delivered from evil."173

Chapter L
All the generations from Adam even unto this day have passed away; but those who, through the grace of God, have been made perfect in love, now possess a place among the godly, and shall be made manifest at the revelation of the kingdom of Christ. For it is written, "Enter into thy secret chambers for a little time, until my wrath and fury pass away; and I will remember a propitious day, and will raise you up out of your graves."

[Clement's last line is a paraphrase of Isaiah 26:19-21, which teaches the resurrection will be before the indignation, or wrath, or tribulation.]
Isa 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that
dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
Isa 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide
thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
Isa 26:21 For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their
iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

Chapter LVI
He shall deliver thee in six troubles, yea, in the seventh no evil shall touch thee. In famine He shall rescue thee from death, and in war He shall free thee from the power of the sword. From the scourge of the tongue will He hide thee, and thou shalt not fear when evil cometh. Thou shalt laugh at the unrighteous and the wicked, and shalt not be afraid of the beasts of the field. For the wild beasts shall be at peace with thee: then shalt thou know that thy house shall be in peace, and the habitation of thy tabernacle shall not fail. Thou shall know also that thy seed shall be great, and thy children like the grass of the field. And thou shall come to the grave like ripened corn which is reaped in its season, or like a heap of the threshing-floor which is gathered together at the proper time." Ye see, beloved, that protection is afforded to those that are chastened of the Lord; for since God is good, He corrects us, that we may be admonished by His holy chastisement.

The repeated references to being "hid", and "delivered" and "gathered together" and "protected" all indicate a pretribulation rapture. Hiding is a theme of Isaiah 26:20, which he just paraphrased, and the rapture, being hid in heaven, hid in the bridal chamber at the wedding, compare these verses about the rapture:

Pss 27:4 One thing have I desired of the LORD, that will I seek after; that I may dwell in the house of the LORD all the days of my life, to behold the beauty of the LORD, and to enquire in his temple.
Pss 27:5 For in the time of trouble he shall hide me in his pavilion: in the secret of his tabernacle
shall he hide me; he shall set me up upon a rock.
Pss 27:6 And now shall mine head be lifted up above mine enemies round about me: therefore will I offer in his tabernacle sacrifices of joy; I will sing, yea, I will sing praises unto the LORD.

Zeph 2:3 Seek ye the LORD, all ye meek of the earth, which have wrought his judgment; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the LORD's anger.

Chapter LVII
Ye therefore, who laid the foundation of this sedition...

[The sedition Clement mentions is the doubting of the resurrection, as mentioned earlier in Chapter XXIII. And he goes on to describe the fate of these of the sedition, that they will lose or miss the hope, and be cast into tribulation. The "blessed hope" is the rapture: Titus 2:13 "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;"]

Ye therefore, who laid the foundation of this sedition, submit yourselves to the presbyters, and receive correction so as to repent, bending the knees of your hearts. Learn to be subject, laying aside the proud and arrogant self-confidence of your tongue. For it is better for you that ye should occupy a humble but honourable place in the flock of Christ, than that, being highly exalted, ye should be cast out from the hope of His people. For thus speaketh all-virtuous Wisdom: " Behold, I will bring forth to you the words of My Spirit, and I will teach you My speech. Since I called, and ye did not hear; I held forth My words, and ye regarded not, but set at naught My counsels, and yielded not at My reproofs; therefore I too will laugh at your destruction; yea, I will rejoice when ruin cometh upon you, and when sudden confusion overtakes you, when overturning presents itself like a tempest, or when tribulation and oppression fall upon you. For it shall come to pass, that when ye call upon Me, I will not hear you; the wicked shall seek Me, and they shall not find Me. For they hated wisdom, and did not choose the fear of the Lord; nor would they listen to My counsels, but despised My reproofs. Wherefore they shall eat the fruits of their own way, and they shall be filled with their own ungodliness."

The reference to when "sudden confusion overtakes you", is as if a quote from 1 Thess 5:2-3, Paul's teaching about the rapture.

1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

And Clement's last line, "they shall eat the fruits of their own way" is such an appropriate rebuke to those who deny the pretribulation rapture. They, who teach we must endure the tribulation, will certainly have to endure it themselves.

Admitedly, the doctrine of the pretribulation rapture is never mentioned explicitly IN MODERN TERMS, but it is very strongly implied by the many examples provided of deliverance and salvation for Godly people, and the overwhelming evidence is that tribulation and wrath is stored up for those who have rejected God and scorned the doctrine of the resurrection and return of Jesus. In fact, it might be said that Clement's letter so strongly makes the point that tribulation comes to those who reject God, that he was being inconsistent with the examples of tribulation and martyrdom that came to the Apostles who died. But Clement did mention the Apostles, and martrydom, and he conclusively shows that such tribulations came from only an ungodly source, that of wicked men. This, therefore, seems to be Clement's proof that tribulation from ungodly men is different from the wrath of God that is stored up and is to come, and therefore, the experience of martyrdom for the Apostles is no proof that Christians are appointed to endure the great tribulation to come. Thanks Clement, I'll have to remember that great pretrib rapture argument the next time some post tribber starts telling me that the tribulations the Apostles faces means that I'll have to go through the tribulation to come!


In The Epistle of Polycarp to the Philippians, Polycarp, like Clement above, rebukes what appears to be the main heresy of his day, the denial of the resurrection.

From www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-11.htm#P770_145457

Chapter VII
"For whosoever does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh, is antichrist; " and whosoever does not confess the testimony of the cross, is of the devil; and whosoever perverts the oracles of the Lord to his own lusts, and says that there is neither a resurrection nor a judgment, he is the first-born of Satan. Wherefore, forsaking the vanity of many, and their false doctrines, let us return to the word which has been handed down to us from the beginning; "watching unto prayer," and persevering in fasting; beseeching in our supplications the all-seeing God "not to lead us into temptation," as the Lord has said: "The spirit truly is willing, but the flesh is weak.

It seems to me that Polycarp is refuting those who deny both the coming rapture and tribulation, calling these the resurrection (rapture) and judgment (tribulation). In response, Polycarp appeals to the word of God: the key phrase in the Lord's prayer, "not to lead us into temptation" that refutes these heresies, namely, by showing there is a judgment (temptation), and that there is deliverance from it (resurrection and rapture).

Matthew 6:13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.

Does the word "temptation" refer to the tribulation or time of trouble to come? Of course.

3986 peirasmos {pi-ras-mos'}
from 3985; TDNT - 6:23,822; n m
AV - temptation 19, temptations 1, try 1; 21
1) an experiment, attempt, trial, proving 1a) trial, proving: the trial made of you by my bodily condition, since condition served as to test the love of the Galatians toward Paul (Gal. 4:14) 1b) the trial of man's fidelity, integrity, virtue, constancy 1b1) an enticement to sin, temptation, whether arising from the desires or from the outward circumstances 1b2) an internal temptation to sin 1b2a) of the temptation by which the devil sought to divert Jesus the Messiah from his divine errand 1b3) of the condition of things, or a mental state, by which we are enticed to sin, or to a lapse from the faith and holiness 1b4) adversity, affliction, trouble: sent by God and serving to test or prove one's character, faith, holiness 1c) temptation (i.e. trial) of God by men 1c1) rebellion against God, by which his power and justice are, as it were, put to the proof and challenged to show themselves

A most commonly quoted verse used to support the pretribulation rapture today is Rev 3:10, which uses the same word, "temptation", the same word in the Greek, peirasmos.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

[wateredseeds]

While i think it can mean "departure" the bible does make it clear that there would be a falling away from the faith. Peter and Paul talk extensively about the characteristics of the latter days. I don't think it matters if the one word is departure or not though...the pre-trib rapture is definitely there in the text.

[popcorn]

Departure!!! ;D

[PrisonerOfHope]

Strong's defines "apostacia" as 1) a falling away, defection, apostasy.

Maybe it's a final separation of the sheep and the goats - the true Christians who will be raptured from the profession Christians who don't have a personal relationship with Jesus and will be left behind.

[shann0]

I tend to lean towards a dual meaning... both apostasy and departure. We see and discuss apostasy.. its rampant everywhere. And departure was used in prior bibles... studying the root words does seem to bear out the departure idea.

[wateredseeds]

I agree that it is probably dual in meaning. Like i said though, i don't think it matters either way. There definitely will be and IS a falling away from the faith as taught by Paul and Peter.....and there definitely will be a pre-trib rapture according to the text.

[Javanut]

Funny, I just did a blog post about this and then came over here.

I think you did a better job of researching and I think we both came to the same conclusion! Good job!

[shann0]

Thanks, I have been a little preoccupied lately. I just saw this response... sorry I a little slow

[emortimer]

Well do not forget...the only thing holding the evil back is the Holy Spirit. So when the Holy Spirit leaves we go also ;D ;D. So come on Holy Spirit lets GO

[popcorn]

Rapture Occurs When?
;D

[PrisonerOfHope]

JD Farag did an excellent study on the meaning of the word this week (8/26). Only thing is, he put down those who are King James only; pretty much calling us "cultists."

As good as the message was, he's lost credibility with me over that.

[popcorn]

I think it is because john calvin is on the side of westcott and hort's? Here is a good link that talks about this.

Calvin was not crucified for me. I would never call myself a Calvinist, a Baptist or any such thing. Do not follow man and his traditions. Follow the scriptures.


www.jesus-is-lord.com/hort.htm

Ignorant people are now saying that the Authorized King James Bible is wrong because they have believed the scholarship of these two blaspheming infidels. You will read their words for yourself in this article.

Westcott and Hort's Greek New Testament is the "source text" for many of today's modern Bible translations. These men were hereticks. [The personal letters of Hort and Westcott sound like the letters of men of the Jesuit order (that is, if you know the Roman Catholic Jesuits. If you are a Christian, I highly suggest that you read the The Deception Series. Not only will you know more about the Jesuits and their activities, you will become more acquainted with yourself, the problems with the visible church, Revelation 17, and these end times.)

Again, Westcott and Hort's Greek New Testament is the "source text" for today's modern Bible versions. Let us examine what Westcott and Hort actually believed.